Today we meet at Lama Sonam’s retreat place in the Hyolmo region of Nepal.
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Some of what Sonam shares includes:
00:01:00 Growing up in Hyolmo and the societal shifts
00:08:00 Sonam’s spiritual upbringing raised with a village Lama
00:10:00 Meeting and studying with a wandering yogi, astrologer and amchi from around the age of ten.
00:18:00 Learning dharma art
00:25:00 Personal experiences with impermanence
00:28:00 Retreat periods, Lama work and what motivated him to build a retreat center
00:37:00 Rebuilding after the 2015 earthquake in Nepal
00:40:00 Sonam shows us the inside and outside of the temple
00:44:00 About the three year retreat space
00:46:00 Building 108 stupas and carving manis
00:48:00 The Guru Rinpoche statue and concluding words his teacher shared on not worrying.
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Rought Transcript
Please excuse all errors
[00:00:00]
I’m Olivia Clementine, and this is Love and Liberation. Today, our guest is Lama Sonam Searing. We come together in conversation at his retreat place in the HHyolmo region of Nepal.
Olivia Clementine: I’m so grateful for you being willing to connect and speak about these things. Yeah, no problem.
Lama Sonam: You know, I don’t have,
there’s some kind of useful talk, but I still, uh, I’m happy.
Olivia Clementine: Well, maybe we start with where were you born?
Lama Sonam: I was just born.
Here, just a little below here, this village has a bone here.
Olivia Clementine: Okay. And so many people don’t know about Hyolmo in particular, what, what, what are some qualities of growing up in Hyolmo? Like certain ways that you, like, what are people [00:01:00] living on, uh, in terms of livelihood and what are some things that make Hyolmo, Hyolmo?
Lama Sonam: Buddha himself also speak about Hyolmo, right, Buddhas, and then later, of course, because of then Guru Rinpoche came here, right, and Guru Rinpoche came here and he blessed, and then somehow, it’s called Beyul, it’s come, some kind of a special, like, in -, Hidden Valley, Beyul Hyolmo.
So that’s a very special for the point view of Dharma, right? So, so that’s why I kind of, yeah, one with this too, because we have, um, we are far away, used to be very far away from like, um, lots of distractions. So that’s, we were born here. Then they will, they are like,
They could [00:02:00] focus on whatever they are living in, like, own religion, own culture, and like that. But it wasn’t that easy to make, like, life, right, you don’t have that much income. But it used to be, when I was very small. Yeah, uh, everybody’s working here. They don’t go that much in out of the country, out of the village.
So they are living here. They’re all doing like farm, farmers. So that wasn’t that easy to make a life. So that’s nowadays, everybody’s kind of tied to make this a bit easier for them to make life. So that’s why everybody, everybody’s kind of left village. So especially I put to do Dharma. It’s a very nice, special place.
Of course, to do Dharma is supposed to be very nice and quiet, right? But here, automatically quiet, so there’s no distraction. So that’s why I think it’s very special for the Dharma people. [00:03:00]
Olivia Clementine: So are you saying then, like now people are really working hard to make money, but back then there wasn’t so much of a priority.
And so what were people doing to support themselves for food, for just basic wellbeing that was common in the
olden days?
Lama Sonam: Yeah, because it used to be like, um, because they don’t, they can’t see what’s in other place, right? Yeah. Nowadays, because of, because of the technology thing, right, they could see everything, right?
What’s going on other place. So, of course, they, they, that’s our nature, right? If what we have, we are not satisfied. If you see something different, you want to have that. So that’s why maybe whoever born here, they’re not happy with that, right? They want a more little bit easier, maybe fancier lifestyle. So that’s why everybody’s, yeah, probably let’s say they’re [00:04:00] all trying to make good living, I think.
So they all go in. First thing, of course, then you’re happy of course, education, right? We don’t have, before we don’t have a nice school, so if someone could do, they will always go to town to have good education. All the way down to
Kathmandu.
Kathmandu, yeah, Kathmandu. So then after Kathmandu, they get some kind of education, the general education, not in Dharma, let’s say.
And then after, when they get this education, after then they want more than that, right? So they will go to then foreign country. How to get good job, get money, and so on. One is kind of good, kind of news for their, just general life, but for Dharma view, little bit sad, you know, everybody’s kind of Soon as they went to school and there’s not much about So there’s a little bit, one way, not only in our community, everywhere we say put dharma a little bit, because what I see is, or [00:05:00] what I’ve seen is like this.
Olivia Clementine: And when you were growing up and people weren’t seeing the internet and blurred into these places, what were some rituals and regular things that you did as a community, like were there regular, um, Just seasonal rituals, like as a community, what kind of Dharma practices were you doing before when you were growing up or ways you gathered?
Lama Sonam: Yeah, yeah. Yeah. The main thing, that’s the thing, you know, that of course, like one, two generation ago, there was a very good teachers,
Olivia Clementine: you
Lama Sonam: know, in Hyolmo area, later than of course, at that time to study, they had to go to Tibet. That’s the thing. Very, very difficult. Still, some people went and studied, came back here and tried to help.
And then, anyway, until us, everybody, we could say, everybody, like, who are in [00:06:00] Hyolmo, say Hyolmo, they are all Buddhist, A to Z, totally Buddhist. But even they don’t understand what is Buddhist about, still they will call Buddhists. Just only, I think they knew it’s just to do some kind of ceremony thing. They do sometimes, like two, three times a year, they do like general ceremony, I think.
I’ll gather, and then sometime after when we, it’s like a, what do you call it? When people pass away, they have to have some kind of ceremony, right? Then after they all have to do Lamas. Only that is that looks like that Buddhist, that’s our Buddhism, our tradition. That’s how people understand. But right now, of course, in India, Tibet, there’s a lot of very good place like Shedra award.
Yeah. Where in my school, they could learn about Buddhist. So, now they’re, who ever is studying Buddhist is now, before it was kind of local, um, local monk, they, [00:07:00] they have a faith, but, um, blind, blind faith, blind, yeah, like that, you know, they all have a faith. They all go and pray, but they don’t know what they are doing, they don’t know, still they will go and pray.
But right now, all people who want to do practice, want to know, they will try to learn, you know, what is really dharma, what is buddhism. So that’s happening right now.
Olivia Clementine: And so for you, when did you come on the Buddhist path?
Lama Sonam: See, that’s the thing, that’s the thing, because I was born in a Buddhist family, so as soon as I was born, I was Buddhist at that time.
Yeah,
Olivia Clementine: yeah. But then, I mean, you’re somebody who practices, and you, you, I mean, you’re a Drupal now, aren’t you? Like, you’re a retreat master here for the three year retreat, and we’ll talk later about all the many things you do and have done. But when did you then really consciously decide to do this? It doesn’t seem
Lama Sonam: like, of course you have seen in [00:08:00] Hyolmo, where you go, each village has a monastery, little monastery, it’s very big or small.
But all villagers, they all do their own practice, right? They learn from their parents or some villagers. That’s how we learn, you know, because when I was born, as soon as I could speak and walk, always, like, something happened, they always go there, right? Mm hmm. So that’s why my father, also he was a Lama.
So first thing I learned from him, you know, whatever he knows, he tries to teach us. That’s how we learn general things.
Olivia Clementine: Like what kind of things?
Lama Sonam: Like chanting, reading Tibetan texts. And then, as I told you, sometimes we do like Guru Rinpoche’s days, not every month, but like every 2 3 months we have Guru Rinpoche’s puja, and then sometimes we do general like smoke offering.
That’s for general thing, right? That sort of thing, whatever happens, we go and we learn like that. [00:09:00] Of course, there’s a lot of that going on. When people pass away, then we have to do like cremating, after cremating we have to do like two, three weeks. Oh, until 49 days we do some kind of ceremony. That sort of thing is a general thing to learn, you know.
And to do that, then of course, even if we don’t know that much detail, we know, of course our parents know that, that reading and doing. Practice is not enough. We have to do like retreat, right? That’s how we learn a little bit like doing just monjo retreat and like that sort of thing. That’s how I learned from our parents actually.
Then later then of course my parents found one teacher, uh, guru. He was great yogi. Somehow he was wandering in Hyolmo area. That’s how my father found him. And then, then he invite to stay in our place here. So he stay here and [00:10:00] then we get to learn a little bit more detail about Dharma.
Olivia Clementine: What was that person’s name?
Lama Sonam: He was, generally we call him Meme Amchi, looks like he was very good astrologist and then medicine, that’s why Amchi. His name was – Dorje, he was great yogi. He, he came to the Hyolmo area when I was born actually, that was in 67. That’s how he’s telling me story. At that time, he came and he was wandering everywhere.
For food, he goes and beg. That was our tradition, right? Tibetan, or some lamas, if they are wearing robe, they could come and beg, and people give whatever they have, you know? They will go to like, About a month long, and then they will bring whatever they get, and then they could do retreat. That’s what was happening.
That’s what he was doing, and that’s how he, how my parents met him. So after four, five years, he was staying [00:11:00] like, up there in – and everywhere. Finally, he came when, he came in our village here, like when I was six or seven years old, something like that.
Olivia Clementine: And did you make an immediate connection with him?
Mm. Mm. When you were young?
Lama Sonam: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Of course, then I don’t have a choice, right? Because of our parents. Of course. Our children have to learn Dharma. That’s all. We are, I was six or seven. I was speaking a little bit with someone, not even speech is clear. But then he sent me to learn Tibetan here.
First thing you have to learn Tibetan. At that time we say like Dharma. Dharma language. But that was not real Dharma language. We came in. He was staying here. At that time he has a little house here. Just right here. On this land. Just little. Evening he went by himself, then morning 6 or 7 he come, and then 10 o’clock we get ready and then he [00:12:00] goes to home, have lunch, and that’s how, again, afternoon he come, and like, that’s how we learn actually.
Olivia Clementine: Wow, do you, and was there a certain pathway he took you on, or was it, what was the, where did you begin with?
Lama Sonam: Beginning is alphabet, alphabet, alphabet, and then that’s Tibetan, how to read alphabet, and then it’s called – and -, right, to read Tibetan, then first half we read Chorlo. Spelling, reading, you know.
That’s why it’s like this. We have to do this, this, and this until we are ready to read. And then we have to read another tag, another tag. Then later he will teach us how to write a little bit. Then like grammar things, that sort of thing. Then when was I? I’m not really sure. Probably when I was 10, 11, something like that.
Then after my dad, one asked to do like ngondro. Prostration, that’s it. Prostration. That’s why I told you earlier. That was too early. We don’t know about that much. [00:13:00] Dharma, Buddhism, practicing. One is we’re kind of happy we get to do some kind of new thing, but one way we are not focusing what we are supposed to focus, right?
That’s why I said it too early. Too early. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So early. But
Olivia Clementine: you probably did all of the prostrations. A hundred
Lama Sonam: thousand prostrations. And then a hundred thousand, like a hundred syllable mantra, that sort of thing. At that time we could read very nicely. Even when we started, like as soon as we know how to read.
And sometimes, of course, my dad, our teacher, we have to go in some kind of puja for the people. Then we get to go to, to all day reading. Most of the time reading or drumming, whatever we’re doing, right? But we don’t know anything about, What we’re doing anyway. Yeah, yeah.
Olivia Clementine: And then afterwards, so once you did ngondro at 11, what happened afterwards?
Lama Sonam: And then still we are kind of in making progress. After that we learn, every year we are doing more retreats. Like, [00:14:00] two, three months in retreat, then my father, he is kind of smart, but he didn’t get to learn those things, but he knew what’s in, supposed to learn, that’s why he, um, Ask me or my teacher to teach us like Tibetan grammar thing, you know, that’s really help, you know, then really we could understand what you’re reading about, right?
Otherwise, just only reading Tibetan text, we cannot understand what does that mean, right? So grammar was the important thing. First thing we learn grammar, it took, I don’t know, four, five, six months, something like that. Grammar and then step by step and then like astrology and then medicine, that’s all.
Years and years of doing that, right? At that time, sometimes we do enjoy, sometimes Why do we have to do that? Because at the same time, other people Going out and like, kind of, uh, what do you call it? Like, [00:15:00] some people have like cows and buffalo. They get to go Farmers and nomads. Farmers and nomads. They get to go look after them.
I don’t. Because we always have morning and afternoon. We want to, need to come here to Sometimes I want to go with them. That’s what we were thinking. But we didn’t have a choice. My parents, my father was very strict. If he don’t do what he says, of course then we get Yeah, yeah, yeah. That’s how until I was, um, 16, 17, then we were always with my gurus at that time.
We just kind of, we finish one do and we did like real sadhanas, rituals and like that at that time. We know a little bit about dharma until I was 16 or 17. And then, yeah. Even, uh, [00:16:00] one, uh, one time we, at that time we don’t get, like, Tibetan calendar, right? Because he was very good astrologer and then we learn.
Me and, uh, I have one, another friend came and learn how to make Tibetan calendar. Even we make Tibetan calendar too. And then, yeah, even one year, one time, one year, even we, what’s called, publish a copy or whatever it is, print it on the Tibetan calendar, you know, the dailies, that’s how we did it. And then they were, um, Guru tell me, you know, now I think what I, Noise, I think you guys learned.
So now you have two choices. If you want to be monks or like that, whole life is dedicated to Dharma, then you don’t have to worry about things. Just you could stay in the retreat and do practice. But if you are not ready, you want to become monks, and then after you have to think about, make, Your [00:17:00] life, how to make your life comfortable, right?
So, if you want to go and do some other job, you could do that. That’s the kind of permission I got. Then, at that time, I had to think for a while, you know. So, what should I do? Now, at that time, I know a little bit about Dharma, right? What’s Dharma. So, I don’t want to go anything, something against Dharma, right?
I don’t want to work for Dharma. So, and I decided to do, focus on the art. While I was learning with my teacher, because my father was an artist too. He was a sculptor and painter too. I was learning a little bit, so I wanted to, if I could learn some Dharma art, then I could, same time I could get some money and same time get Dharma.
So that’s how I focused. After I was 16, then I He went to Kathmandu. And also I met one Buddhist teacher, sculptor. That’s why I studied with him. [00:18:00] Then a little bit different story now.
Olivia Clementine: I want to hear that. Just really quickly about your Amchi. Because I came here yesterday and you were celebrating the anniversary of his death.
Right, right. And so he’s your root guru. Yes, yes. And so after that, that entire time you said you were learning even to like go out and gather plants. Yeah. And is that something that you continued onwards at all as to the astrological wisdom or, um, Amchi knowledge? Amchi, Amchi, yeah, yeah. Did you continue any of that?
Lama Sonam: Yeah, yeah. I did actually. Until now or? No. When, when I started to focus on art, then I was like totally just kind of. Little bit. I was, of course, doing morning and evening. I’m doing practice, whatever I’m supposed to do. Other than that, I just, I was really focusing on art. I didn’t do that much about that.
And so, the art teacher, what’s his name? He is from Bhutan. His name is – yes. Is he still around? [00:19:00] Um, I’m not really, I haven’t talked to, contacted him almost for four, five years. He was here, and then He was invited by one Lama from Kathmandu. His name is – Rinpoche. So he came to work for him.
And we have a very good connection with – Rinpoche. That’s how he was working there. And I went to help him. And that’s how I learned.
Olivia Clementine: Okay, okay. And um, so will you share? Because you have so many different skills in the arts.
Will you share then about, uh, all the things he taught you? And then we’re going to actually, it’s just so wonderful to walk around and see some examples. Yeah. Yeah.
Lama Sonam: So that’s the thing. I also, there’s a space. It has a whole different, uh, I don’t know how to say, life or whatever you call it. Dharma and art, right?
And also art,
personally I know a little bit about, I have a background, right, already [00:20:00] because my dad was an artist. So I know how to paint and such and such thing. I wasn’t happy with that. That wasn’t kind of making me happy, right? Oh, I need to go a little bit more than this. That’s why I went to him. Because, of course, if one person is doing so many things, it cannot be that detailed and nice, right?
That’s what happened to my dad, you know. But I have some kind of idea. I was working with a Buddhist teacher. He was also very young. He is also same as me, you know, he has a like, um, what do you call that? He is also a good practitioner. He knows about Dharma. And then, of course, I know a little bit about Dharma, and that’s why we are very good friends.
We’ve become very good friends. Uh, so he really likes me, and then I also like him. And then we always get very good. So, are you staying a little bit too? Two years, something like together, you know, wherever he get invited, I get to go with him and then [00:21:00] working or learning same time. Art means always kind of, other thing is we could listen and if he have good knowledge, we could learn.
That’s it. The art is first have to understand, then watch by eyes and then have to have good hand too. to make right even if some people have like they could understand but their hands doesn’t help drawing or making something they can’t do anything right so yeah art is lots of work actually not like kind of modern art right that’s have to follow and especially buddhist style When we were making statues, polishing is very important, you know.
You have to polish very nicely, smooth. So when you paint or gold leaf, it’s totally smooth. That’s the main thing. Yeah, that’s That’s how long. And after, after three years, then after two years studying with him, then after some time he went to the At that time, I was [00:22:00] 18. The first time when I was 18, I made one statue by myself, you know.
At that time, it was when my father was still alive. He gave me some kind of idea, advice, and then myself, I was working. That is nearby here, actually. I was just 18.
Olivia Clementine: In a way, you have to be a perfectionist to be a dharma artist in this kind of context.
Lama Sonam: Yeah, one with this too. They’re older than me, I’m younger than them, but still my mind is, I have a feeling.
Big response, I thought, man, I’m very old now. My mind is already maturing. I always said my children too. They’re like 20, 25. Still they look like children. Wow, what’s happened? When I was 17, 18, I thought, man, I was grown up. Growing up, I have, I took big responsibility, you know, that’s all like that. Totally.
See, that’s looks like you have to have like, karmic connection, [00:23:00] like previous lives, karma, and that’s how it is. Some people is still 20, 30, they don’t have anything responsibility. They always like, act like children, right? But I was like that anyway. When I was 17, 18, I thought I Big grown people, you know, adult people, you know, that’s all I have.
Olivia Clementine: Yeah.
Lama Sonam: Feeling.
Olivia Clementine: Yeah, yeah. It makes so much sense, especially knowing what you’ve accomplished now. There’s a part of you that’s able to do so much that, that feels very karmic as well. Yeah, I think so. The naturalness of it. And, um, okay. So you started doing arts at 18, really delving in, and then how long did you study with that artist from Bhutan?
Lama Sonam: I was like, just only three years I was working with him, and then later, of course, he went to Bhutan, and then somehow, at that time, in Hyolmo area, I think, I have to say, just only me, probably, that new style, making statues.
Olivia Clementine: Yeah.
Lama Sonam: So, then I started, then I, immediately I became, [00:24:00] like, busy. Yeah. One week, my father, he also kind of, well known person, he’s an artist, you know, in Bhutan.
So people contact him and then he’s recommended, Oh, of course, now my son is also better than me. Then you could work. That’s how we did it. I worked there and I went to other place, Gorkha, and the other place also to work, you know. At that time, my father also with me. At that time, when I was only 18, at that time I was able to do sculpting myself.
Painting is still, I wasn’t, you know, Perfect. But I know a little bit, I wanted to make progress about painting, same time sculpting and painting. But for me, used to be like, Tibetan Buddhist, Bhutan, you are sculptor. Sculptor, just only he does sculpting only, right? And if you’re a painter, then they do only painting.
They don’t do together, you know? So [00:25:00] for me, it’s gonna each help each other, you know? That same year, then actually my father passed away, actually. It was a little bit difficult for me, you know, I was just only 18.
When he passed away, I was working with my teacher in the other side of the village. It was like one hour, two hours, something down here. I was working there. With my other good teacher. Amazing, you know. At that time, we don’t have a telephone or nothing. Not that far, just two, three hours.
We don’t hear that much. I was working with teacher here, then my parents here. I have always feeling very bad and having very bad dream actually. Then somehow I decided, no, I want to go and check my home. Then I decided to come home and then at that time he was okay. Even at that time some other people passed away in our village right here.
And my father was a Lama too. He was doing ceremony like [00:26:00] after three days we do like one ceremony. It’s called Nyingjang Neyden. We are kind of, let’s see, liberating the dead people. Neyden. He was doing that ceremony when I got home. Then, as soon as I got home, I went to that place and I helped him, and then after 6, 7 p.
m. he came home, and then suddenly he got, like, a very bad headache. And then, he never went, never cured, you know, all night he was kind of, bad headache, and he was not, I mean, painful, but he said, I’ll close my eyes, and like that. No, it’s not bad. No, no, it’s not good, you know. The next morning, he passed away.
That’s how. Of course, then I had to deal with that. At that time, I got a little bit sick. Before that, I never got sick and nothing like that. Then, of course, we have to deal with, like, until [00:27:00] 49 days, we have to go to the hospital. Usually, we have three brothers. I’m the youngest one. My middle brother was studying in Kathmandu.
The older brother was in India. See, he was going to make, he went in there to make some money. That’s why he went to India. Ah, so you were the only one there. Yeah, I was the only one here. Even as I was working there, just I came here, then that day he passed away. So did you do the cremation for him? Yeah, yeah.
He organized it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was just 18, 18 that time. Yeah.
Olivia Clementine: What makes sense to you earlier, you saying that you were like an adult that used to use it. In a way, you kind of went through so many things that somebody else never thought. That, for that, actually,
Lama Sonam: for dharma, it really helped. I know a little bit about dharma, and of course we have to die and stuff, but it’s going to happen.
And that’s really helped me, you know. If I don’t know anything about dharma, it will be very hard, you know, for me. Like, at that early age, he’s passing away
like that. Yeah,
Olivia Clementine: it’s a really connected permanence and the preciousness. Yeah. So You [00:28:00] started at 18, as we said, and then how long after that were you focused on the arts and dharma?
Like, have you been doing that ever since?
Lama Sonam: Yeah, after that, of course,
I don’t know what year that is exactly, but since then I go out and work a little bit. Of course, every year I come in like, what’s it called? Summer time, it’s when it get rainy season and like that, you don’t have that much. Things will be outside. If I get time, I will come and do retreat actually. At that time, my teacher is still alive, right?
He was still alive. We come in one, two months, two, three months, we come and do retreat.
Olivia Clementine: And what were some of the retreats you were doing? What was the focus? Retreat,
Lama Sonam: yeah. And lineage is, uh, it’s, it’s called -, Hyolmo area at that time on the Nyingma, inside Nyingma, there’s like one northern treasure.
It’s called – yeah, we are doing is [00:29:00] like, I don’t know, sometimes – sometimes it’s -, actually. – cycle, it has its own cycle, what we are doing. So we are doing, we are teaching all about that, you know. There’s of course so many data, you know that right, like control changes, and Lama, Yidam Khandro, Three Rules, and that sort of thing we
Olivia Clementine: have to do.
Lama Sonam: for that, because after that, my father passed away, and I had to do a little bit of Lama’s work too, right? To do that kind of ceremony, we have to do retreats, we have to finish, like, to do some kind of ceremony for the dead people, we have to finish like that. We always do the charity practice, we have to do charity, and then peacefully, we Peaceful in there, and we have to do retreat bad, and that sort of
The same time we are working, and focusing on doing retreat too.
Olivia Clementine: Are you retreating in a cabin?
Lama Sonam: No, I resit. Okay, now that’s good. [00:30:00] That’s the only reason I built here Retreat Center, right? At that time, we don’t have anything like that. If we want to do retreat, we have to make our own little, what do you call it?
Little hut. Around we put some kind of bushes, cut bushes, and top we put plastic or tab like that. Just temporary. Then we have to bring our own food and we cook by ourselves, you know? At that time, one time, we had a very difficult, you know, I was, we were three people doing just only somewhere there, my teacher was staying here, we had been three months retreat, like just after even, not even a month, one night, we had some kind of very funny noise, you know, I don’t know what that was.
We was cooking and just, we, sleep and next morning one of my friends went just soon as he’s kind of light he went outside he saw tiger in our [00:31:00] hut right here oh my gosh there’s tiger two of them so scary you know then we look and then he went tiger went all the way down that little spot here and funny are they sleeping there yeah as soon as getting dark and he come around here and then around our ridge cabin, you know, coming there and playing there and making noise, you know.
Then we know there’s tiger, we couldn’t go out, we couldn’t sleep all night. All night we’re making fire like that. We heard that if animal, they doesn’t like fire. The next morning, same thing, three days, you know, kind of like that, daytime that goes down, and evening come here and play around our retreat, whatever hut.
Then we talk to my teacher, no, because he cannot go because he made commitment, right, three months. He cannot go, you know, they have no choice. You and the tiger. Yeah. That was so difficult, you [00:32:00] know, that’s why I started, you know, oh, if that’s possible, of course. We had that kind of difficult situation, right?
If you get rain or wind, and then it’s rain dripping in like that. That’s why I thought that when I grow up, you know, after my harbor, I went to the west. And then that’s how I have some kind of idea, and I could have some money. So that’s why I decided, maybe it could benefit some local people, you know, who want to do liturgy and like that.
Maybe it might benefit, that’s the idea. How ideas did center, building a digital center. That’s the thing.
Olivia Clementine: Wow, yeah, it came from your own experience.
Lama Sonam: At the same time, of course, then after, uh, after, no, no. Uh, after, um, um, Few years ago, my teacher went to Bhutan and then I was working here, around here, everywhere, you know.
It was always busy, but I never had to go [00:33:00] and find a job, you know. Always people coming and asking me to come and help. That’s what I was doing, you know. Because, probably that’s what I was Some people, artists, of course, they always think about money. I was thinking that, you know. What was possible? What would they offer?
I take that and I try to help them. That’s what I was doing. And then in 93, my Buddhist teacher, uh, actually he went to 92 in the U. S. A. somehow, but he didn’t like that much in the West. Then he couldn’t finish his project and he came back and then 93 he asked me, would you like to go to America to help me?
Of course, I don’t have any clue. I don’t have any concept going west. Of course, I’m happy to go and see, you know, America. I have some kind of dream, you know. Then, that’s how we started going to the west. Then we went to the west, U. S. A. [00:34:00] In California, first time I was flying, you know, in a plane. Sometimes I dream about flying in a plane, you know.
That’s how I get to go to, that was in 93. I will stay in 6 months, then we come back again. And then later again, 97, again they contact us and that’s how I went there. Then, of course, they need more jobs and that’s why I thought maybe, oh, maybe better to stay over there. I could help a little bit about what I know in Dharma, right?
So
Olivia Clementine: were you helping with building stupas? Building stupas,
Lama Sonam: statues, painting, and like that sort of thing. And then, of course, they ask me, keep asking me, then Then also I ask them, you know, okay then if I need to help here, then maybe then I better, I should get green card. We should apply at that very easy level 97.
That will come very easy to apply. Then they help me to apply my resident car. Then I got green card. That’s how I’m stuck there, you know? Mm-Hmm. , [00:35:00] you still, I wasn’t staying there, you know, long as I get green card, then I go there, like work four, five months and come back and then I have idea, you know, at that time I don’t have that kind of big.
Dream, you know, always I come and I help to build a little, wherever they need, repaintings, statues, like that, like that. Before that, my teacher was passed away anyway. That was in 93, so when I went to USA, at that time, my teacher passed away. Did he pass before you left? No, no, after I left, then he passed away here.
So then I always have a dream, you know, if I could do something, benefit, I should. Of course, I always want to go in. At that time, here’s nothing, you know, my teacher passed away, my father passed away. There’s nothing here, you know, I’m telling you. Actually, the top there was actually a cremation place, actually.
There’s one wall stripper there. [00:36:00] That’s how then, uh, Now, of course, I want to do something in my own village, because I have my own village, or maybe I get to learn here, because of my teacher. At the same time, a villager who really needs help, what I could help, that’s how. First thing, I brought this statue.
You see, then my, At that time, I don’t have this kind of, any kind of dream, you know, to build a stupa or a retreat place or nothing, you know, later. But, I’m going west and at that time also I get some more money and then, okay, I want to do something expanded. And then finally, I have a, oh, okay, now I want to build a retreat and that’s how I did.
Olivia Clementine: And when was that?
Lama Sonam: That was, you know,
nine five, six, seven years ago. First thing, first thing, put statue there and then slowly at that time, this place is cut out. Old, where my teacher was staying here, you know. That was so sad to see, you know, old, kind of ruined building, you know. Then [00:37:00] I decided to do this thing, little gathering hall, whatever. I built that.
As soon as I finished building everything, I did big ceremony thing. And then earthquake hit. Then all destroyed, that little place destroyed. And then, oh, that was Big thing again. That was in, when was that?
Like
Olivia Clementine: 2015? 15? Yeah. That, that, that
Lama Sonam: year. That was before I made this building. Like all style, you know, Estonian clay in stone? Mm-Hmm. All style, but it didn’t survive. Earthquake. We finished for the celebration. All finishing. I went to USA after 10 days, a week. And then I heard that earthquake. I had to come back immediately.
Olivia Clementine: So is this building now more earthquake? Yeah, earthquake
Lama Sonam: proof, earthquake proof. Yeah, yeah. And that time, just right after two days, three days, I came back Kathmandu and I just came here. Because they didn’t tell me what [00:38:00] happened exactly here, that it’s all gone, you know, it’s all not useful. This building is survived.
This building was survived. Then I came here, you know, wow. I was thinking at that time, I have a life. Dharma point of view, oh, that’s impermanent, that’s nothing. I was here in cleaning, time to clean, everywhere scattering, somehow sad, somehow okay, that’s impermanent. Now that’s, that’s, here it is. Nothing to attachment.
Same time, at that time, Dudjom Rinpoche’s Yangsi,
They came here actually, I was doing that and they came with little kind of, um, relief package, what do you call, and here’s the one media guy too. He was in, he wasn’t in dress in the Dudjom Rinpoche, and then I recognized him, then later I asked him. Yeah, he’s in Dudjom Rinpoche, [00:39:00] and then first later I’m just. Here’s some local people who even maybe just, some people trying to clean here.
Then later, I told him a story, you know, that media guy asked me, Wow, you lost everything here, but still you’re so happy. How come? He asked me that, you know. Of course, that’s always my experience. Natural, whatever you say, right? Yeah, I’m happy now, because now I don’t have to take care of anything. I’m so happy, free, that’s why I’m happy, you know.
that point, I wasn’t sure, you know.
Okay, now, that’s so useless. I spend lots of my time and money. At that point, I wasn’t sure that I’m going to rebuild again, you know. No, I don’t think I could do it again, you know. That’s why I have a doubt. I just cleaned it in the video and then I put some good valuable things, built a little shelter and put everything there.
Then I went back, you know, I had to do some job. Then again, I couldn’t stand, you know, everything. [00:40:00] Ruin everything scattered. No, no, I have to do it. I have to work hard.
Olivia Clementine: We’re looking at the inside of the beautiful temple that you’ve created and This used to be your root guru’s home. Right. When did you rebuild it?
Lama Sonam: That was, let’s see, 2007.
Olivia Clementine: And do we want to walk through, like, cause I mean, you’ve done so many, there’s so many details here that you’ve done with your own hands. Can you bring us through the process? More
Lama Sonam: is I mean, our Plastic silicon. And then after that, this is so small. White cement. People think these are all some kind of metal, but it’s not metal.
And after this statue is [00:41:00] made out of concrete. I made that just to, just before earthquake. But luckily this building didn’t Classically, it got a little damaged, but it’s still surviving.
Olivia Clementine: Anything else we should pay attention to here? Um,
Lama Sonam: not much actually. Yeah, this is all also that building itself is my idea, you know.
I draw some kind of idea, design. So main thing is here also. We don’t have a pillar. We used to have a pillar to make this big building, right? So I didn’t put pillar. This is all metal work. That’s also my idea. At that time I wasn’t working metal anyway. When I saw idea, then I got idea, right? So then I bought little machine and then I learned from them.
Olivia Clementine: So this is the outside as well. It’s surrounded by stupas and each of these you built? What was the process?
Lama Sonam: [00:42:00] Here is actually one set of stupas. There’s supposed to be eight of them. A little bit different, you know, base and top part is same, but this middle part is all different, right? Edge is different, and rest is same, but all together I have 108 strips here.
I mean, these are all, of course, I have to fix my hand, other one is, I made more again. So I made Mo and then Mo is bottom part is metal and top part is of course I have to use Silicon Mo. And I have a under and H altogether.
Olivia Clementine: And what is inside? Oh,
Lama Sonam: matches is white cement, white cement and sand I use. And then inside is of course we have to use mantra, right?
Mm-Hmm. . So while we are making casting, we make empties inside. So that’s why when we finish, when we are putting together, then we put mantra. Mantra in middle part, we say [00:43:00] Sokshin, it’s called life force or whatever you say, Sokshin. Each has a Sokshin, Sokshin made out of juniper, like that.
Olivia Clementine: What does that look like, the life force one?
Kind of,
Lama Sonam: what do you call it? There’s no shape or nothing like that, just only bottom part is supposed to be square and then top part is supposed to be round. One stick anyway. Bottom is a little bit bigger, top is a little smaller, it’s called -. When we are making Tibetan style, I think, Tibetan Buddhism, have to have that sort of thing, you know, when make stupa or statues.
Olivia Clementine: And what, how do you decide what mantras go in?
Lama Sonam: Oh, that is, there is a thing. Text we have to follow that this depends what kind of deities you are making and then each has a different Generally all the same, but there’s a little bit things we have to change Each deities like Shakyamuni Buddha. He has own mantra and Guru Rinpoche own [00:44:00] mantra like that.
Olivia Clementine: And then here you have your song offering space, your,
Lama Sonam: um, fireplace.
Olivia Clementine: So there’s the three year retreat space. You are the retreat master, right?
Retreat master, I don’t know if you could say it. There’s these guys that like, they check in with you about their practice. Yeah,
Lama Sonam: I invite one Lama, one, he’s, you know, one of the main students, he lives in Hyolmo too. I ask him to give, like, empowerment, that sort of thing, because he’s seen it, and, you know.
Of course, that’s why I have respect for him. To begin, I asked him to come here and give teaching and empowerment. After that, then I could, um, teach or talk about how to chant during session and that sort of thing. And also I could, of course there’s instruction in Tibetan, right, and I could read, and I could understand, I could explain to them.[00:45:00]
Olivia Clementine: But he mainly comes and gives the name teachings, and then you kind of advise. He advises, yeah.
Lama Sonam: I see,
Olivia Clementine: I see. And you said that there’s six people in there? Right now, at the moment. But usually there’s
Lama Sonam: a room, it’s kind of a big room. Good for the 8 people. Somehow we studied the 8 and some kind of we had a problem, then two had to leave and right now we have six.
Olivia Clementine: And um, all
Lama Sonam: different genders or? Yeah, used to be one Anis here, female, rest is male, but right now just only six Lamas, yeah.
Olivia Clementine: Okay.
Lama Sonam: They are from, two of them from India Sikkim actually. And others, they Around here.
Olivia Clementine: And so now we’re in another little spot, and these are, is this part of the 108 stupas?
Yes,
Lama Sonam: right. Around here, and
Olivia Clementine: then
Lama Sonam: around the temple, it’s all together 108, yeah.
Olivia Clementine: Yeah. And, and then you have all of the Mani
Lama Sonam: Mani mantra, yeah. We have more than 500 depth square, [00:46:00] what do you call it, stone, I don’t know what it’s there. It took me, it took, almost about a year, you know. No, no, five, six months.
Like six, seven people walking every day. And then, yeah. First thing, I draw that mantra and then everybody’s walking. Carving, chiseling.
This is just a monument, right? That’s what you see, right? The little stupa there. Inside there is very special. It’s called, um, One text is called Dotarba.
Olivia Clementine: Um.
Lama Sonam: It’s like, like this kind of stone.
Little bigger than that. Like, I have more than 200 stones. All have a little small, um, text. It’s a big book, actually, which I carved into. Stone and then that’s there. It’s very dotharva. I don’t know how to say. Sutra, actually, sutra. Sutra, whoever [00:47:00] reading and hearing, it says it could get liberate, right?
That’s very dotharva. – means liberating, right? Liberate. So that’s the sutra. That was in there, it’s super easy, right? First I have to write down, then I, that time I invite one, um, guy from Dholpa actually, he was doing all the time that carving. He was there like more than a year actually, carving every day.
Then after finish that, actually when I put gold leaf, I add like gold leaf, then I put it back in there. Usually we put mantle, right? Print in paper. But, for long lasting, that stone means stone, that will be there forever,
Olivia Clementine: right?
Will you tell us about the Guru Rinpoche statue?
Lama Sonam: Um, before statue, of course, he had a wall stupa here.
So at that time my teacher was alive, he was staying right here. So after [00:48:00] he passed away, then he started to cremate my Guru also right here. So later I found this Guru Rinpoche statues. Before that, I have also idea, you know, I want to build or something. I, because I didn’t want to make out of cement or nothing, right?
It is not permanently safe, right? That’s why finally I found this Guru Rinpoche statue. Actually this was, this statue is made in Khas in India, Delhi. Under Khenpo Namdor Rinpoche, he has a plan, you know, he want to, um, spread that Gurumi statue as much as he could. So right now, so far, they made same size, same one, like more than 30 statues.
That’s everywhere, like United States, they have three of them, in Germany, France, Canada, Australia, everywhere actually. Somehow I got one too, then, oh, this is perfect. You know, even this is brass, so [00:49:00] it’s, it’s not going to be no scope. Damage or nothing like the weather, right? That’s why I decided to choose So after my guru passed away and this is empty space and then I thought oh, maybe I should put here So to put that this hill is all covered with the big trees like that over there.
We see like big trees I have to clear out these Trees to do that. Of course, we don’t have any machine or nothing I asked our mind villager. It took 10 days to clean this whole Mountain we are using just Axe? Axe and just hand tool, you know, that’s how we put it here. So at that time, we don’t have a, like, road.
So, I have to hire that 25 seater helicopter, Russian helicopter, you know, that’s Nepali, government owned that. I have to hire that to bring that statue here. So, after that, One year, then [00:50:00] also we made this road, you know. The statue itself is brass, but the bottom throne is stone and cement. All those designs are carved into cement.
But, first when we made the statue and throne, but when the earthquake happened, the throne was totally kind of destroyed by the earthquake. Almost like bomb, but statue itself didn’t affect that much, so I had to build again. Now this is earthquake proof.
Olivia Clementine: So, I mean, speaking of the, uh, uh, Pyramid of Patience, I feel like you have a tremendous amount of patience, I mean, having done things twice.
Lama Sonam: Twice, yeah, I know, that’s the, you know. First, I thought maybe I was kind of tired, you know, when first finish and then earthquake destroyed and I thought, oh, no, no, I can’t do that. I got a little tired. After a year, first thing after I cannot leave this, like, that damage, then first thing I want to build statue.
And then rest, the wretched place, and that, I’m, I wasn’t [00:51:00] sure. But seeing that destroyed ruin, then that didn’t, you know, Make me happy, you know. Oh no, I have to do something again. That’s why I started again. It took like four years to finish whole thing. Start again. Hopefully now it will last for a while.
Yeah.
Olivia Clementine: And what is, what is, what’s happening for you now? Are there other projects underway or?
Lama Sonam: No, actually now kind of I’m financially or maybe physically tired now. That’s it now, I don’t have a Building a project like this is not the big deal, but maintaining is the big deal. Maintaining is the Since I started, I’m always here to maintain.
That’s the big deal. When I started, I started by myself. Now usually I made one committee to take care of that. Because, um,
Olivia Clementine: what’s
Lama Sonam: it [00:52:00] called? I don’t know what to say. To have that kind of thing, you have to have some kind of committees, right? This is not my private thing. So this, I made one committee, but committee is just for the paperwork.
So everything’s like, you know, I’m checking everything.
Lama Sonam: So in future, I’m not worried too much one way, you know, I will do what I could in future. If people has a karma or merit, they could do something, they could maintain or they could rebuild or anything, but my part is, whatever I could, I do.
That’s all. That’s what my teacher told me. Don’t worry about future. Do whatever you need to, whatever you could. Future, if that something happen, it will happen. If not, then don’t worry that, you know.